Luis Moreno-Ocampo Responds to Questions from Workshop Participants
Luis Moreno-Ocampo is the Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court. As a Prosecutor in Argentina, Mr. Moreno-Ocampo was involved in precedent-setting prosecutions of top military commanders for mass killings and other large-scale human rights abuses.
In 1992, Mr. Moreno-Ocampo resigned as Prosecutor of the Federal Criminal Court of Buenos Aires, and established a private law firm, Moreno-Ocampo & Wortman Jofre, which specializes in corruption control programs for large firms and organizations, criminal and human rights law. Until his election as Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court, Mr. Moreno-Ocampo worked as lawyer and as Private Inspector General for large companies. He also took on a number of pro bono activities, among others as legal representative for the victims in the extradition of former Nazi officer Erich Priebke to Italy, the trial of the chief of the Chilean secret police for the murder of General Carlos Prats, and several cases concerning political bribery, journalists’ protection and freedom of expression.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo has been a visiting professor at both Stanford University and Harvard University.
Many thanks to the chief prosecutor for taking the time to respond to many of the questions submitted by workshop participants. The following is a list of some of those questions and Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's responses.
Workshop Participant Abhishek Yende wrote:
Mr. Luis Moreo-Ocampo, as the first and the chief prosecutor of ICC, one cannot forget your contribution in the development of ICC. May I ask you about your experiences while conducting trial before ICC ?. Your experience about attitude of Judges, Nations, the procedure of the trial and enforcement of orders? How a student doing postgraduate in law like me, can contribute in this process?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Dear Abhishek Yende, As you rightly said, being the first prosecutor of the first permanent and independent International Criminal Court is a privilege and a responsibility. This is one of the most challenging and fascinating jobs. But my work will mean nothing if people like you are passive. What can you do? It depends where you are, but you can help victims to participate in the Court, you can promote debates in your law school about what I should in the Palestinian case, you can analyze and debate our policies or the judges’ decisions. You can follow how the UN Security Council manages the Darfur situation. Or you can help to educate children in schools.
Workshop Participant Tangwe Abraham Tamukum wrote:
Hi Mr.Luis,
I want to find out your experiences so far as a lead prosecutor of this court? Do you enjoy your job?. Is it true that the way this court goes about its activities makes it bias?
How can we as the civil society dispel this subjective view from the minds of observers? In fact, do we have a role to play other than being by-standers?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
I am selecting situations and cases to investigate in accordance with the law, the Rome Statute, but we are working in deeply divided societies. History shows that the Nazis convinced millions of Germans that they were right to eliminate Jewish people and other minorities; during the genocide in Rwanda, many Hutus were convinced that they were right to exterminate the Tutsis. They were not thinking about the others as fellow citizens, but as the enemy. This is the huge change that the Rome Statute is introducing. A new idea: there is a global system to protect everyone.
"How can we as the civil society dispel this subjective view from the minds of observers? In fact, do we have a role to play other than being by-standers?"
Yes, see my previous answer.
Workshop Facilitator Sonjanita L. Moore wrote:
Hola Senor Moreno-Ocampo!
It will be an honor to hear from you about your work!
My questions are:
1. With all that you've seen in your own country and with the work you've done thus far with the ICC, what do you think is the future of the ICC - given the many obstacles and challenges you've encountered?
2. What can be done to educate young people about the plight of their international peers? What role is the ICC playing in global education?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
In just 6 year, the ICC became a reality. Now the Court, the idea of no impunity for the most serious crimes is present in any conflict around the world. This is the future. To apply the law to eliminate massive atrocities.
“2. What can be done to educate young people about the plight of their international peers? What role is the ICC playing in global education?”
If we want to prevent massive crimes we should educate billions of kids around the world. They will make the difference. The ICC can help to connect with the ministers of education from the 110 States Parties.
Workshop Participant Dominic W. S. Chan wrote:
Hi there Mr. Luis Moreno-Ocampo
A) How effective is the International Criminal Court (ICC) without an enforcment mechanism?
B) Do you feel that the ICC is sometimes a talkshop (when countries refused to cooperate) and even then you need the legitimacy of the UN Security Council to argue for justice?
C) Effectively, to date how many Islamic countries have left the body and why they left?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
No court has its own police. As any other Court, police and armies have to follow the judges’ orders. This is the path.
"B) Do you feel that the ICC is sometimes a talkshop (when countries refused to cooperate) and even then you need the legitimacy of the UN Security Council to argue for justice?"
Ask our detainees about talk shop. Ask President Bashir. We needed the Security Council to start the investigation in Darfur, because Sudan is not a State party of the Rome Statute.
"C) Effectively, to date how many Islamic countries have left the body and why they left?"
No State has left the Rome Statute.
Workshop Facilitator Mary Hendra wrote:
Thank you for participating in this discussion, and for opening your work to the film-makers so that more can understand what you do! The ICC can seem so abstract without the picture of individuals such as yourself and the actual work that you are doing. I have several questions for you:
1) How would you define the success of the ICC?
2) Related to this, I was struck by the indirect impact of the court - the ICC as impetus for changes internally in addition to the direct impact of arrest warrants and trials. In response to ICC actions, Colombia and Uganda both seem to have strengthened internal dialogue about rule of law and internal commitment to seek justice. Do you consider this type of response a success of the ICC?
3) What do you think about non-court methods of justice and reconciliation such as the gacaca in Rwanda or Truth and Reconciliation Commissions? In your view, what is the connection or interaction between these processes and the ICC?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Success will be 2 billion kids from all over the world that understand and support the idea. Success was an Australian pilot who refused to drop a bomb during the Iraq war because he realized that the real collateral damage would be bigger than planned. He realized that if he executed the order received, he could be prosecuted in accordance with the Rome Statute. He returned to his base without dropping the bombs.
"2) Related to this, I was struck by the indirect impact of the court - the ICC as impetus for changes internally in addition to the direct impact of arrest warrants and trials. In response to ICC actions, Colombia and Uganda both seem to have strengthened internal dialogue about rule of law and internal commitment to seek justice. Do you consider this type of response a success of the ICC?"
This is the most important aspect. It is not what happens in The Hague, but how the Court impacts on the world.
"3) What do you think about non-court methods of justice and reconciliation such as the gacaca in Rwanda or Truth and Reconciliation Commissions? In your view, what is the connection or interaction between these processes and the ICC?"
Gacaca was a very interesting experience. It was not a trial, it was like a community plea bargain. Truth Commissions could be very useful, in Argentina it was the foundation for the trials and in other countries it played a different role.
Workshop Participant Jamie Lott-Jones wrote:
Mr Moreno, Do you believe that through the precedent set by the arrest of LRA leaders, the ICC can effectively call for the arrest and trial of Taliban leaders who are recruiting and using child soldiers in Afghanistan & Pakistan?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
The preventative impact, in Pakistan or elsewhere, will depend on many factors, including how people like you can explain what the Court is doing.
Workshop Participant Jamie Lott-Jones wrote:
If I may, I'd like to ask a 2nd question.
My colleagues & I teach 9th grade World Cultures. As part of our curriculum, the kids are each assigned a UN country at the start of the school year. All year long they study the United Nations and their country and are continually challenged with "representing" their UN country on issues we cover in class. At the end of the year, students submit a portfolio on the UN and their country which includes examinations of the Security Council, EcoSoc, resolutions, cultural norms, biographies, NGOs, etc. and they participate in a 3 day long Model UN simulation in which they handle a "crisis"
At this time, we do not have a specific ICC component.
In your opinion, what would be the most critical activity or study we could include in our program? What learning outcome do you feel is the mmost important for students to walk away with--- especially if we want to see the US change it's policy toward the ICC?
Thank you!
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
t is a very interesting experience. I think you should develop a module about the interaction between the UN Security Council and the ICC decisions to indict Minister Harun or President Bashir.
Workshop Participant Kaila Schwartz wrote:
Senor Moreno-Ocampo,
First, thank you for the work that you do. I am sure that there are many more days filled with frustration than triumph, and yet you have found the strength to remain dignified in the face of outrageous lies from the opposition. I applaud you for that.
My question is how we, as world citizens, can effectively apply pressure to the United Nations to do more than simply allow you to do your job; that the ICC is aiming to fulfill the goals that helped create the UN and that they should, therefore, be helping to enforce arrest warrants? And, if the corruption and impunity lies within the "hallowed" halls of the UN, shouldn't we focus some energy on disbanding the UN itself?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
We have to make the system work better. The ICC is having an impact on the work of the UN. You can maximize this impact. You can lobby 15 ambassadors and you will have an impact on the UN Security Council.
Workshop Participant Colleen Napora wrote:
Thank you for joining our discussion. I was wondering specifically, if you have any advice for my students on how they can help join the ICC. Is there a place for interships for high school or college students. I have students who are very active and are always looking for ways to get involved and I would love to be able to give them information about this.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
We have no internships for high school students right now, but you can check what other institutions do. For instance, groups like “Invisible children” is working with young volunteers. You can see their videos on You Tube.
Workshop Participant Dean Francey wrote:
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo,
I would like to ask about the ICC's constitution. The film mentions that there were a number of conferences convened to discuss the laws but I am curious as to what the law's actual basis is.
1)Is there an effort to try and incorporate as many legal traditions from around the world as possible or is it heavily based on one specific country's constitution or an existing body of international law?
2) Furthermore international laws are obviously much different than an individual nation's law so how would you generally characterise the difference between the two (if any difference exists)?
PS. There are many Argentinean students in Toronto and I am sure this question will come up when I show the video: River or Boca?
Thank you very much and keep up the good work at the ICC
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
It is a very much discussed effort to combine different traditions, particularly civil law and common law, as well as a little of Sharia law.
"2) Furthermore international laws are obviously much different than an individual nation's law so how would you generally characterise the difference between the two (if any difference exists)?"
The legal differences are details at the end of the day. My real problem is the huge gap between a lawless environment like Darfur and the court room.
"PS There are many Argentinean students in Toronto and I am sure this question will come up when I show the video: River or Boca?"
Boca of course.
Workshop Participant Patty Kean wrote:
Mr. Luis Moreo-Ocampo, thank you for accepting this role. And, my sincere gratitude also to your colleagues at the ICC. Are you investigating the crimes against humanity occurring in Chechnya? The suffering there seems endless and those who courageously speak truth and/or assist the suffering, are being killed. In particular, I am thinking of Natasha Estimerova's murder this past summer ~ among many others in this poor, exhausted, suffering people.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
I am not the world Prosecutor, I have jurisdiction on crimes committed on the territory of or by nationals of 110 States parties of the Rome Statute. Russia is not a State Party, as well as Iraq or the US, therefore I have no jurisdiction there. The UN Security Council can refer a situation regarding a non State Party to me acting under chapter VII of the UN charter.
Workshop Participant Deborah S. Bertschi wrote:
Mr. Luis Moreno-Ocampo, thank you for participating in a discussion with us in order to help us understand the ICC. I have a couple of questions that I would appreciate your answers to: 1. Last summer with the trouble in Gaza, will there be any "investigations" into the stories of the civilians, those inside Gaza, that suffered? If nothing is done about these events, will the ICC pursue justice? 2. Has the US taken their investigations into the mistreatment of prisoners in Iraq and Guantanamo far enough? 3. What makes a conflict a "case" for the ICC? Thank you in advance for addressing these questions.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
There is a resolution of the UN General Assembly asking the Secretary General to follow on the investigation conducted into Gaza. A report will be produced in February. The Palestinian National Authority accepted the exercise of jurisdiction by the Court with respect to acts committed on the territory of Palestine since 1 July 2002. We are analyzing if this declaration meets the requirements established by the Rome Statute. My Office will carefully examine all relevant issues related to the jurisdiction of the Court, including whether the declaration by the Palestinian National Authority accepting the exercise of jurisdiction by the ICC meets statutory requirements; whether the alleged crimes fall within the category of crimes defined in the Statute, and whether there are national proceedings in relation to those crimes.
"2. Has the US taken their investigations into the mistreatment of prisoners in Iraq and Guantanamo far enough?"
I cannot comment on it.
"3. What makes a conflict a "case" for the ICC? Thank you in advance for addressing these questions."
When there are serious allegations of crimes against humanity, genocide or war crimes, committed by nationals or in the territory of States Parties after the 1st of July 2002, and when there are no genuine national investigations to address these allegations. Additionally, the UN Security Council can refer to the Court a situation regarding any country in the world were such crimes were allegedly committed, and a non State Party can accept the exercise of jurisdiction by the Court without joining the Rome Statute, through a declaration of acceptance under Article 12(3) of the Rome Statute.
Workshop Participant Ssenteza Paul wrote:
Dear Luis, thank you for your courage. I would like to know hope you cope with the pressure of penetrating beyond the excuses of state sovereignity and the influence of big powers in your efforts to bring to book the perecuators of crimes against humaninty both in the global south and owerful north.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
My work is to apply the law regarding situations were massive crimes occurred. People are divided by serious and highly politicized conflicts. Part of my job is to ignore the criticism and the compliments. Just to focus on my work.
Workshop Participant Amy Rosenberg wrote:
Mr. Moreo-Ocampo,
1. Do you think that the United States not being part of the ICC has affected its effectiveness?
2. Is there a way to make the process for justice go a little faster and more efficiently so the victims can see justice achieved?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
No. In fact, in some regions it contributed to our legitimacy, but in the long term the Court has to be accepted by all countries.
"2. Is there a way to make the process for justice go a little faster and more efficiently so the victims can see justice achieved?"
There will never be enough justice for massive crimes. The ICC is contributing to this process for justice, by investigating and prosecuting the most responsible for the most serious crimes. In just over six years, we have been analyzing situations in over five continents, opened 4 situations and 8 cases, issued 13 arrest warrants and one summons to appear; today, 4 individuals are detained in The Hague; two trials have started, and at least another one will begin next year. Witnesses are being protected and victims are participating in the proceedings. This is our contribution. And the impact of our work will also help to push for more accountability, for more justice for victims all around the world.
Workshop Facilitator John Englander wrote:
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo, thank you so much for being a guest in this online workshop on the ICC. I would like to add a question into the mix:
In 2012, you will have completed your 9-year non-renewable term as Chief Prosecutor of the ICC, and a new prosecutor will be elected. What are the checks/controls in place to insure that the member states will elect someone who does not "play politics" by entering the office with a personal agenda--someone who will bring a non-partisan approach to the important role of Chief Prosecutor?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
This will be the responsibility of the 110 States Parties and the civil society representatives that will monitor the election.
Workshop Participant Frank Arthur Turner III wrote:
Dear Luis, I admire your dedication and commitment to the struggle to end genocide. Can you elaborate on China's decision to provide weapons that facilitate the killings? Am I correct to assume that they have an interest in the oil reserves?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Sudan provides an important quota of the oil that China needs. The most part of Sudan’s budget goes to buy weapons. China is one of the main providers. But that does not mean that China will oppose to stop the crimes in Darfur.
Workshop Participant Carol LaVallee wrote:
Mr. Luis Moreno-Ocampo,
First I would like to say what an honor it is to have your insight. I teacher a Holocaust and Genocide class to high school students in Florida. My students and I have three questions...
1. What advice would you give to my students who are interesting in helping their peers understand the impact of genocide today, after all these young people will be inheriting these issues?
2. (from my students) In your experience working with the ICC, what seems to be the main reasons that extreme Human Rights violations continue to occur in our world?
3. (from my students) How are genocides today different from the ones in the past?
Thank you.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Can they develop ideas on how to teach genocide and massive crimes? What do they need to know? How can they present these problems to young students. Why are they interested? If they answer these questions we can do something better.
"2. (from my students) In your experience working with the ICC, what seems to be the main reasons that extreme Human Rights violations continue to occur in our world?"
It is always the same: to protect my group I support attacking those that we perceive as the enemies. You can apply it to any case, and at the end this is the basic idea. That is why imposing a legal framework, with no enemies and no friends, with no double standards but the rule of law, could be a solution.
"3. (from my students) How are genocides today different from the ones in the past?"
They are probably better planned, and we have more information about them. In the case of Darfur, we have demonstrated how rape and hunger are the weapons to destroy Darfur communities. One victim escaping from the attack in her house, overheard one attacker say: “Don’t waste bullets, they’ve got nothing to eat and they will die from hunger”. Another victim explained “They kill our males and dilute our blood with rape. They want to finish us as a people, end our history”.
Workshop Participant Valentina Vitali wrote:
Dear Mr Moreno Ocampo,
thank you so much for your work and for accepting to take questions from us.
Do you think that European Union or individual European states should excert pressure over African states or the African Union to cooperate with the ICC with regard to the al Bashir case?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
In fact Africans are leading the adoption of the Rome Statute and its implementation.
a. Kofi Annan conveyed the Rome Conference, South Africa was leading many discussions.
b. African states led the ratification process. Senegal was the first state party. Africa is the most represented region of the world in the Rome Statute. 23% of the state parties.
c. African judges are 25% of the bench.
d. African leaders referred three situations to the Court. Benin and Tanzania, as African members of the Security Council voted in favour of Darfur referral. Algeria abstained.
e. 50 % of our requests for assistance go to African states.
f. African countries surrendered 75% of the suspects.
g. The African Union panels in Kenya, Darfur or Guinea are supporting end of impunity as the principle and the operations of the Court.
Workshop Participant Abdulai Alhaji Sulley wrote:
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to ask you a few questions. (1). Mr. Luis Moreno-Ocampo, there is a perception in Africa that the ICC is mainly to prosecute African leaders and others from the developing economies around the globe. Is that true or false? How will you demystify this claim in people's minds if it is not true? (2). Is it possible to bring those who devastated Iraq to justice under international law? (3).Are there any legal instruments to help the Israelis and Palestinians to possess land in the region? (4). Who is funding the ICC?
Thank you Sir,
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
The Africa bias is a baseless debate started and promoted by President Bashir. He knows how to divide groups to follow his goals. He did it in Darfur and he is trying to divide those who are trying to stop the crimes. President Bashir should not divert our attention from the discussion on how to implement justice and, in particular, how to stop the crimes against Darfuri victims.
Since the request for an arrest warrant for President Bashir, there has been a controversy about an alleged “Africa bias” promoted by President Bashir and supported by some leaders.
a. There are two problems of perception: That we are targeting Africa following a neo-colonialist agenda and that we are ignoring other criminals.
b. About targeting Africa. There are 14 accused, all of them are Africans. There are more than 5 millions African victims displaced, more than 40.000 African victims killed, thousands of African victims raped. Hundreds of thousands of African children transformed into killers and rapists. 100% of the victims are Africans. 100% of the accused are African. As Desmond Tutu said: Choose your side. Do you associate with the victims or the perpetrators? I am on the victims’ side. I will not apologize for that.
c. About ignoring other bigger criminals, in particular from the North. Africans are tired of double standards. So am I. The issue is: are we going to implement one standard? Or are we going to reinforce the double standard? I am not the world Prosecutor; I am the Prosecutor of 110 states. Iraq, Sri Lanka, USA, Lebanon or Israel are not states parties. However, creative lawyers can offer legal options. A group of South African lawyers supported by Max Du Plessis and John Dugard came to my Office to submit information on alleged crimes committed by a South African citizen who was working as the legal advisor of the Israeli Armed Forces during the Gaza operation. Regardless of the final assessment my Office will make on our jurisdiction in Palestine, their activity is a contribution to new ways of promoting a new system of justice.
I am very pleased to see that the AU, as an institution, has played and continues to play a leading role in peacekeeping efforts and in conflict management in Darfur.
"(4). Who is funding the ICC?"
The 110 States Parties.
Workshop Participant Marguerite Kling wrote:
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo, thank you for having the fortitude and courage to spend so much of your life involved in the pursuit of justice. I am a high school teacher and my students spend much of their time studying about genocide and crimes against humanity. They are frequently troubled and confused about the idea and process of justice in the international community. I would appreciate your answers to the following questions:
1. Would you be so kind as to provide us with your definition, or interpretation of the word justice?
2. In such a diverse and conflicted world, is it possible to come together to agree upon a universally accepted concept and application of justice? Is that what is necessary for the ICC to be effective and successful?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
This is a very difficult question to answer in a few lines. At a global level we are still very primitive, we are trying to do justice for the victims of massive crimes but the Rome Statute has not yet been ratified by all the countries in the world. So there is a long way to go.
"2. In such a diverse and conflicted world, is it possible to come together to agree upon a universally accepted concept and application of justice? Is that what is necessary for the ICC to be effective and successful?"
Many agree on the definition of what are the crimes, but it is still difficult to agree on the efforts to stop the crimes. States have complex agendas and it is not always easy to justify spending national money and the life of national soldiers in remote conflicts.
Workshop Participant Glenda Johnson Elam wrote:
Hello Mr Moreno-Ocampo,
I would like to join the others here in thanking you for taking up this awesome task. Your Prosecutor presence really encourages many like myself to do the what we can to see a positive change in Sudan. What will you be doing as a way forward now that the indictment has been given?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Arresting a head of state requires a process of marginalization first. This happened with Richard Nixon after the Watergate and is happening now with President Bashir. This process of marginalization of indicted criminals, if maintained steadfastly, is a way towards the ultimate implementation of the arrest warrants issued by the Court. Respect for the Court’s decision to issue an arrest warrant against President Al Bashir sends a clear message: President Al Bashir will face justice. Any leader committing crimes will face justice. Power does not provide immunity. There was no immunity for President Milosevic, there was no immunity for Prime Minister Kambanda; there was no immunity for President Taylor. There will be no immunity for President Bashir; his arrest is a matter of time. The Court is permanent and can wait. His victims cannot wait. We should do more to stop the crimes.
Workshop Participant Felicia Mode Alexander wrote:
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo,
You are my hero! Thank you for committing your life to bringing justice to those who perpetrate crimes against humanity. In our studies of the Holocaust and modern genocides my high school students are particularly outraged by the use of rape as a weapon of war in the 21st Century. By bringing charges against the men who run the LRA and other militias, but without a military wing of the ICC, how will this stop, or lead to similar arrests of the actual perpetrators of these atrocities against women?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
Gender crimes are central to each of our cases in a way that clarifies how sexual abuses are a specific instrument in each conflict. As a war crime in the Bemba and Katanga/Ngudjolo cases, where women were raped as a tactic of the armed conflict, as a crime against humanity in the Joseph Kony case, where women and girls were abducted to be used as sexual slaves, and as part of genocide in the case against President Bashir, where raping women and girls is the way used to destroy the communities. In the Lubanga case, we also presented the gender dimensions of the crime of enlisting and conscripting children under the age of 15 years. The evidence showed how Thomas Lubanga instrumentalised sexual violations to subject child soldiers of both sexes to his will, and made them tools to further his own violent goals. Girl soldiers, some aged 12 years old, were used as cooks and fighters, cleaners and spies, scouts and sexual slaves. One minute they would carry a gun, the next minute, they would serve meals to the commanders, the next minute, the commanders would rape them. They were killed if they refused.
Workshop Participant Yael Siman wrote:
I first want to thank Mr. Luis Moreno-Ocampo. I would like to know what is the relationship between the ICC and regional courts that also have a legal mandate to investigate and prosecute human rights' violations? (such as the regional court in Latin America - "Corte Interamericana de Derechos Humanos")? Why in the case of Colombia there was an appeal to the ICC instead of the "Corte Interamericana"? Does a "case" first need to be investigated by the corresponding regional court?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
There are two different systems. The Inter American Human rights system or the European Court are about the duties of the States to respect and enforce human rights. Individuals present complaints against States. There are no criminal regional courts. There are cases against Colombia in the Inter American Court of Human Rights.
Workshop Participant John Padula wrote:
Dear Mr. Moreno-Ocampo:
With all that you are doing, I am honored and grateful that you are able to be part of this online forum.
I wanted to start by saying that I greatly enjoyed your video interview and comments on the Nuremburg Trial. Your mention of Justice Jackson caused me to do some research on him (I am embarrassed to say I knew little about him!)... I discovered his eloquent words from the opening and closing statements of Nuremburg and I can see how his ideals and hopes give you inspiration as you continue forward with your work with at the ICC. Thank you for that insight!
I hope you can help me understand a few aspects of your work with the International Criminal Court:
(1) While it makes sense that the ICC is an independent organization, the ICC relies on the cooperation of the international community to take charge of its warrants/indictments. I wanted to take the matter to the next level: What happens in the case where someone is brought to trial and convicted by the ICC? I assume the ICC judges determine a sentence/punishment. Who would be responsible for carrying out that sentence?
(2) Have there been any conversations with President Obama (or his administration) about the possibility of the United States finally joining the ICC? It seems to me that gaining the US as a member of the ICC would provide a boost to this organization.
I wish you well in your fight for international justice!
Regards, John Padula
P.S. I saw your interview on CNN Friday. You made an excellent point about ICC warrants putting pressure on leaders (e.g. President al-Bashir). I have read that al-Bashir now rarely travels outside of Sudan due to the ICC warrant. Your thoughts on marginalizing leaders over time to ultimately bring them to justice may be the one way the ICC can combat reluctance by world governments.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
There are not trials in absentia before the ICC. So when someone is convicted, he or she is going to jail. The Court makes agreements with states in order to find prisons to enforce the sentences.
"(2) Have there been any conversations with President Obama (or his administration) about the possibility of the United States finally joining the ICC? It seems to me that gaining the US as a member of the ICC would provide a boost to this organization."
There is an evolution in the US approach, but I don’t think the US will join the Court in the near future; in the meantime we are working together in many cases.
Workshop Participant John Padula wrote:
Hello again: I'm sorry - since my last post, I read that the governing board of the ICC will be conducting a 7-year review at its annual meeting. I also read that they will be considering some amendments to the operation of the ICC. (I read one commentary that said the idea of finally defining ‘aggression’ as a punishable offense may be on the table!)
Could you share some of the changes being considered?
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
The main discussion will be about the possibility to define “aggression” and agree on a process to prosecute such crimes.
Workshop Participant milton phangwa wrote:
Mr Morena-Ocampo do you think it possible to charge Mr Robert Mugabe for crimes against humanity and also for hiding a fugitive from justice, the former leader of Ethiopia, colonel Mengistu. What is done to encourage prosecuters to be impartial and not allow themselves to be used as tools to silence the opposition. Lastly how can the African governments be helped to embrace the ideals of the ICC. I pose the question because of all the countries in Southern Africa,only Botswana is prepared to hand Omar Bashir over to the ICC.
Mr. Moreno-Ocampo's response:
To do it before the ICC, there is a need for a UN Security Council referral, because neither Zimbabwe nor Ethiopia are States Partyies of the Rome Statute.
"Lastly how can the African governments be helped to embrace the ideals of the ICC. I pose the question because of all the countries in Southern Africa,only Botswana is prepared to hand Omar Bashir over to the ICC."
President Al Bashir, at risk of arrest, has not travelled to the territory of States Parties for high level events which he was planning to attend in South Africa, Uganda, Nigeria, or Venezuela. He cannot attend the UN Climate Conference in Copenhagen. He has not attended the UN General Assembly or, recently, a meeting of the OIC Committee for Economic and Commercial Cooperation in Turkey.
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